IMO, 21 oz+ is just too much denim for a single pair of jeans. personally, i find them waaay too heavy & cumbersome for all-purpose/practical use. when i got my 710s, i promised myself it'd be the 1st & last 19ozer i'll ever possess. then, s5000ai came out. again, i said to myself these will be the penultimmate. 14/15ozers is my ideal weight. the Jins are 17, but i just gotta have thse... & if i can get my hands on those FC x Bear's WWII 17oz, that 'd be the last nail to the heavy denim "c;-)ffin".